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Funny; Tom Peters did not heavily discuss "managers" when he
wrote his award winning tome. (w/Waterman)

Someone said Roger Smith was a great leader. Funny; he bought
so many companies at such prices that GM stock dropped like
a rock for the first time in ages. He tried to buy improvements
instead of LISTENING to his people.

Why don't more managers LISTEN to their most valuable asset;
their PEOPLE???? k. gilbert

On Fri, 14 Mar 1997 18:35:19, KAREN GILBERT <receive@AZTEC.ASU.EDU> wrote:
>Subject: Re: Leaders and Tom Peters

>Why don't more managers LISTEN to their most valuable asset;
>their PEOPLE????
Because they know that anyone willing to work under them could not possibly
have worthwhile ideas.

Why don't more people avoid managers who don't listen?

Jack Ring
602-488-4615, fax) 4616

Jack Ring wrote
<<
>Why don't more managers LISTEN to their most valuable asset;
>their PEOPLE????
Because they know that anyone willing to work under them could not possibly
have worthwhile ideas.
Why don't more people avoid managers who don't listen?
>>

If subordinates were permitted to read the resumes of their future
superordinates, they might go for self employment. <g>
But who want equal opportinity taken to this dimension? <g>
Emil Zahner
Morphological Institute Canada
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/canmor/index19.htm

Jack Ring wrote:

"... Why don't more people avoid managers who don't listen? ..."

then Emil Zahner <<75114.11@COMPUSERVE.COM> replied

>>... If subordinates were permitted
to read the resumes of their future
superordinates, they might go for
self employment. But who want equal
opportinity taken to this dimension?...<<

Emil and Jack have hit on a major problem in the hiring process--
employers' inability to be open and honest with their job applicants.
Employers expect job applicants to be honest, but are the employers
as honest as their applicants? I think not. Quite often managers who
give the right answers behave poorly anyway.

Bob

On Mon, 17 Mar 1997 11:03:15, Emil Zahner <75114.11@COMPUSERVE.COM> wrote:
>If subordinates were permitted to read the resumes of their future
>superordinates, they might go for self employment. <g>
>But who want equal opportinity taken to this dimension? <g>
and
On Mon, 17 Mar 1997 15:58:05, Bob Gately <gately@COMPUSERVE.COM> wrote:

>Emil and Jack have hit on a major problem in the hiring process--
>employers' inability to be open and honest with their job applicants.
>Employers expect job applicants to be honest, but are the employers
>as honest as their applicants? I think not. Quite often managers who
>give the right answers behave poorly anyway.
>
>Bob

I think many companies have expanded their practices to include interviews
with prospective managers and workgroup members. The problem is that most
candidates do not know how to interview the employer -- or are afraid to
ask the hard questions. They could be helped considerably by a course or
other session in "effective job selection." Secondly, they need to
understand that the best way to deal with a lousy manager is with their
feet.

Jack Ring
602-488-4615, fax) 4616

Jack Ring <jring@AMUG.ORG> wrote:

(Hi Jack)

>>... I think many companies have
expanded their practices to include
interviews with prospective managers
and work group members...<<

Yes, I'm aware, however, I wonder how many employers have instructed
their managers and work group members to be honest and to tell job
applicants the truth about the work place as they see it? To be frank
about the managers behaviors, both good and bad, etc?

>>... The problem is that most candidates
do not know how to interview the employer
-- or are afraid to ask the hard questions...<<

If an applicant asks the hard questions, would the reward be a job
offer--all else being equal--or a rejection letter? Few many managers
like to be asked hard questions by job applicants and even fewer like
hard questions from their subordinates.

>>... They could be helped considerably
by a course or other session in "effective
job selection."...<<

Yes, that is how we help employers hire people who fit the job and
how we help people select the career that fits their needs.

>>... Secondly, they need to understand
that the best way to deal with a lousy
manager is with their feet...<<

My estimate is that 80% (or more) of the managers are less than
competent, so the probability of moving to a new employer and working
for a better manager is not too great.

I do agree that employees ought to vote with their feet, but management
seldom puts the ballots into a functioning voting machine to count the
ballots and never for a recount.

Bob