Discussion: View Thread

Regarding the Surgeon: Even if s/he is the best surgeon in the
world would you want him/her operating on you if his/her attitude
was, "Aw, what's one more casualty...sure I'll have another drink
before going to work."?

RC

You are confusing behavior with attitude. The two are not necessarily
link. I don't want any alcoholics doing anything for me.

Secondly, you have selected out a particular aspect of attitude, concern
for efficacy. Again, I would not want anyone doing anything for me that
did not want to do it well. However, they nedd the skill and ability to
do it well in the first place. And for the record I have worked with
professors, engineers, and yes even doctors who in my opinion had a
"poor attitude," but damn were they good at what they did. And I would
rather have them as part of my team then someone who had a "good
attitude," but did not match up to their skill level.


>----------
>From: RICHARD CORCORAN[SMTP:CORCORANRE@EXCELINC.COM]
>Sent: Thursday, April 24, 1997 11:50 AM
>To: MG-ED-DV@MAELSTROM.STJOHNS.EDU
>Subject: Re: Hiring for attitude - Reply
>
>Regarding the Surgeon: Even if s/he is the best surgeon in the
>world would you want him/her operating on you if his/her attitude
>was, "Aw, what's one more casualty...sure I'll have another drink
>before going to work."?
>
>RC
>

Miles Davis <miles.davis@EXSE01.EDS.COM> wrote:

>>... And for the record I have worked with
professors, engineers, and yes even doctors
who in my opinion had a "poor attitude," but
damn were they good at what they did...<<

According to research I have read, doctors who have poor rapport
with their patients are more likely to be sued than doctors with
good rapport with their patients. Incompetence may get doctors
sued, but it is indifference that infuriates patients.

>>... And I would rather have them as part of
my team then someone who had a "good attitude,"
but did not match up to their skill level...<<

Unless of course, you were the hospital administrator and you
had to minimize your exposure to large malpractice lawsuits.

Bob

So, what you are saying is that political considerations should drive
hiring decisions, not necessarily competence.

>----------
>From: Bob Gately[SMTP:gately@COMPUSERVE.COM]
>Sent: Friday, April 25, 1997 7:47 PM
>To: MG-ED-DV@MAELSTROM.STJOHNS.EDU
>Subject: Re: Hiring for attitude - Reply
>
>Miles Davis <miles.davis@EXSE01.EDS.COM> wrote:
>
>>>... And for the record I have worked with
>professors, engineers, and yes even doctors
>who in my opinion had a "poor attitude," but
>damn were they good at what they did...<<
>
>According to research I have read, doctors who have poor rapport
>with their patients are more likely to be sued than doctors with
>good rapport with their patients. Incompetence may get doctors
>sued, but it is indifference that infuriates patients.
>
>>>... And I would rather have them as part of
>my team then someone who had a "good attitude,"
>but did not match up to their skill level...<<
>
>Unless of course, you were the hospital administrator and you
>had to minimize your exposure to large malpractice lawsuits.
>
>Bob
>

Miles Davis <miles.davis@EXSE01.EDS.COM> wrote:

>>.... So, what you are saying is that
political considerations should drive
hiring decisions, not necessarily
competence...<<

Not at all.

I suggest that job applicants be screened first for integrity,
then for skills and knowledge (competence) and then for their
on the job behavior. If we presume that a more qualified
applicant will become a better employee we overestimate
the value of knowledge and underestimate the value of behavior.


Bob

+----------------------------+
| Robert F. Gately, PE, MBA |
+----------------------------+-----------------------+
| GATELY CONSULTING (508) 473-0955 |
| 115 Dutcher Street Fax (508) 634-0670 |
| Hopedale, MA 01747-1006 Toll Free (800) 478-8117 |
| http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/gately/ |
+----------------------------------------------------+

Now, I am on board when we start talking about integrity (i.e., honesty,
reliability, responsible). I see those things in a differnt light then
"attitude," which is too amorphous to have any real value in evaluating.
And I might argue with you on the order that you screen, but why
quibble over bits?

>Not at all.
>
>I suggest that job applicants be screened first for integrity,
>then for skills and knowledge (competence) and then for their
>on the job behavior. If we presume that a more qualified
>applicant will become a better employee we overestimate
>the value of knowledge and underestimate the value of behavior.
>
>
>Bob
>
>+----------------------------+
>| Robert F. Gately, PE, MBA |
>+----------------------------+-----------------------+
>| GATELY CONSULTING (508) 473-0955 |
>| 115 Dutcher Street Fax (508) 634-0670 |
>| Hopedale, MA 01747-1006 Toll Free (800) 478-8117 |
>| http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/gately/ |
>+----------------------------------------------------+
>

Miles Davis <miles.davis@EXSE01.EDS.COM> wrote:

>>... Now, I am on board when we start
talking about integrity (i.e., honesty,
reliability, responsible)...<<

Great.

>>... I see those things in a different
light then "attitude," which is too
amorphous to have any real value in evaluating...<<

That is why we screen for behaviors.

>>... And I might argue with you on
the order that you screen, but why
quibble over bits?...<<

I chose integrity testing then skills and knowledge assessment and
then behavior screening because of the time and costs associated
with each screening methods. Integrity testing cost less than $20 a
test and skills and knowledge assessment takes time to review the resume,
etc., and behavior screening takes about an hour and cost generally less
than $100 for a company of any size. Besides, if
an applicant fails the integrity tests--no job offer. If an
applicant does not meet minimum skills and knowledge--no job offer.
If an applicant passes all other screening steps, behavior screening
may or may not screen them out.

Bob

+----------------------------+
| Robert F. Gately, PE, MBA |
+----------------------------+-----------------------+
| GATELY CONSULTING (508) 473-0955 |
| 115 Dutcher Street Fax (508) 634-0670 |
| Hopedale, MA 01747-1006 Toll Free (800) 478-8117 |
| http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/gately/ |
+----------------------------------------------------+