Discussion: View Thread

  • 1.  Competencies

    Posted 10-04-1997 07:27
    On Sat, 13 Sep 1997, Thomas Ang wrote:

    > I am interested in finding out more about the CORE COMPETENCIES that
    > consultants are expected to possess.
    >
    > I have read articles that wrote about how consultants have failed in their
    > jobs ... and have landed themselves in lawsuits and so on.
    >
    > So what does it take to be a COMPETENT CONSULTANT?
    >
    > What are cognitive skills that one must possess? Can it be learnt?
    >
    > How does one usually end up joining the CONSULTANCY PROFESSION? (i.e CAREER
    > PATH?)
    >
    > Anyone able to share with me of an instance when the CONSULTANCY PROJECT
    > failed because the CONSULTANT was not COMPETENT? ... and by the way how is
    > the SUCCESS of a project measured?
    >
    > I will be very glad if I can get in touch with people in the CONSULTANCY
    > PROFESSION ... and hear from them their FIRST-HAND ACCOUNT. Hence ... would
    > appreciate if all the Consultants could take some time to reply to this
    > mail.
    >
    > Of course ... I will be equally glad to hear from others as well.
    >
    > Looking forward to getting in touch with all of you!
    >
    >
    >
    > THOMAS ANG
    > E-mail: thomasang@post1.com
    >
    As a professional speaker and consultant there are several skills one needs
    to be successful (in this case we are talking about manking $$$). To be
    successful one has to:

    1. Have good speaking skills - if you can't communicate effectively you will
    have difficulty in expressing your ideas. Being a professional speaker who
    teaches people these skills I of course of bisased on how important these are.

    2. Learn how to effectively market yourself - One has learn how to market
    your services well. Each market may require different marketing skills and
    approaches. One of the best marketing tools is to do a great job for
    someone and have them tell everyone. Learn waht marketing approaches are
    appropriate for your business and target market.

    3. The list, the list, the list - the list of potential clients one creates
    has a huge impact of your direct mail marketing efforts. The better the
    list, the better the success.

    4. Develop Good Listening Skills - Too many people do not listen to what the
    client wants and tries to sell them what they need. Remember, people act on
    what they want and not necessarily on what they need. It is your as the
    consultant to provided them with what they need while giving them what they
    want.


  • 2.  competencies

    Posted 11-20-1997 01:28
    Regarding Phil Rutherfords helpful input on competencies, it is worth noting that while the UK historically uses 'output' or 'skills-based' competencies e.g. 'Chairing meetings', the US traditionally uses 'input' competencies, i.e. what underlying characteristic, e.g. creativity, change orientation, etc. the person has that he/she brings to the position.  They are more 'personality-based' and hence more difficult to develop, but on the other hand allow more flexibility for the individual within the organization since jobs change but people are selected for the competencies needed for the (future of) the organization.   
     
    A book that hasn't been mentioned but provides an excellent discussion of competencies is 'Managerial Competence: the Key to Excellence' by Harold M. Schroder, published by Kendall/Hunt, Iowa, 1989.  ISBN 0-8403- 5540-8  May be hard to find, but worth the effort.
     
    Jess Levant
     
     
    Phil Rutherford wrote:
     
    Most countries involved in the development of competencies at a national
    level (ie, National Skills Standards Board, ANTA, NZQA, NCVQ etc.) all
    will have official documentation on the processes. However, most of
    these are written from a bureaucratic and non-first hand experience
    position with little (or very old) user input.

    If it is of any interest, I have written two books on competency-based
    assessment ("Comptency Based Assessment: A Guide to Implementation" and
    "Competency Based Assessment: The Assessor's Guide" published by Pitman
    Publishing [now Woodslane]) both of which go into great depths on the
    subject of competency development, the implementation within an
    organisational or even educational setting, and assessment on the job
    against them. I'd be happy to give any further info on these should
    anyone want it or call my publisher direct (Robert Coco on
    robertco@woodslane.com.au).

    There are a number of other good books that have been published but they
    mostly deal with assessment, accreditation of prior learning etc. and
    can be accessed through Kogan Page in London. Look for the names Simosko
    and Fletcher. These centre on the UK system but can also be of use when
    contextualised.


  • 3.  competencies

    Posted 11-21-1997 03:46
    Tricia

    FYI
    andrew

    ----------
    | From: / , , , MG-ED-DV@MAELSTROM.STJOHNS.EDU; / , , , j.levant@WHICH.NET
    | To: / , , , MG-ED-DV@MAELSTROM.STJOHNS.EDU
    | Subject: competencies
    | Date: Thursday, November 20, 1997 1:00AM
    |
    | Regarding Phil Rutherfords helpful input on competencies, it
    | is worth noting that while the UK historically uses 'output'
    | or 'skills-based' competencies e.g. 'Chairing meetings', the
    | US traditionally uses 'input' competencies, i.e. what
    | underlying characteristic, e.g. creativity, change
    | orientation, etc. the person has that he/she brings to the
    | position. They are more 'personality-based' and hence more
    | difficult to develop, but on the other hand allow more
    | flexibility for the individual within the organization since
    | jobs change but people are selected for the competencies
    | needed for the (future of) the organization.
    |
    | A book that hasn't been mentioned but provides an excellent
    | discussion of competencies is 'Managerial Competence: the Key
    | to Excellence' by Harold M. Schroder, published by
    | Kendall/Hunt, Iowa, 1989. ISBN 0-8403- 5540-8 May be hard to
    | find, but worth the effort.
    |
    | Jess Levant
    | www.management.org.uk/Users/JessLevant
    |
    |
    | Phil Rutherford wrote:
    |
    | Most countries involved in the development of competencies at a national
    | level (ie, National Skills Standards Board, ANTA, NZQA, NCVQ etc.) all
    | will have official documentation on the processes. However, most of
    | these are written from a bureaucratic and non-first hand experience
    | position with little (or very old) user input.
    |
    | If it is of any interest, I have written two books on competency-based
    | assessment ("Comptency Based Assessment: A Guide to Implementation" and
    | "Competency Based Assessment: The Assessor's Guide" published by Pitman
    | Publishing [now Woodslane]) both of which go into great depths on the
    | subject of competency development, the implementation within an
    | organisational or even educational setting, and assessment on the job
    | against them. I'd be happy to give any further info on these should
    | anyone want it or call my publisher direct (Robert Coco on
    | robertco@woodslane.com.au).
    |
    | There are a number of other good books that have been published but they
    | mostly deal with assessment, accreditation of prior learning etc. and
    | can be accessed through Kogan Page in London. Look for the names Simosko
    | and Fletcher. These centre on the UK system but can also be of use when
    | contextualised.
    |
    |
    | <<File Attachment: UNTITLED.BIN>>
    | ATTACHMENT MANIFEST 1.0
    |
    | =BP TYPE FILENAME RENDER
    | 1 NOTE
    | 2 FILE untitled.dat -1
    | =END
    |


  • 4.  Competencies

    Posted 11-24-1997 23:28
    Thank you Aim??? Heene, for bringing up the subject of competencies, though
    it may have been discussed here earlier & I may have missed it. If so, I
    apologize.

    I am currently writing an article RE: career development center within public
    sector organizations, and one of the points addressed is the trend towards
    "building competencies". While Aim???'s question is a search for publications
    addressing competence in organizational dimensions, I am interested in the
    current popularity of competencies addressed by HRM on the individual level,
    especially in lieu of Aim???'s reference:

    "The 'competence' concept as it has been developed in strategic management
    literature is however an
    ORGANIZATIONAL concept, which has of course to do with competence of
    individuals, but which is
    not exactly referring to these individual competencies. (Sanchez, et al,
    Dynamics of Competence
    Based Competition, 1996)."

    My question to the list, then, is: so what about those competencies? Are
    they indeed being packaged for HRM at the individual level? And if that's
    the case, is it appropriate? A well-known consultant in the career
    development field, Betsey Collard of Career Action Center up in Silicon
    Valley, has come out against the use of competencies for use at the
    individual level. Her perspective is that with the psychological contract
    broken, employees as well as employers should support employee career
    self-reliance. Competencies drag both parties back into the outdated
    paternalistic relationship.

    I would very much like to hear from any HRM professionals who have
    implemented or are considering competencies for their organization. Please
    feel free to respond to this list if others are interested, or directly to me
    & I will summarize for the list. Thank you.

    Lynn Vavra


  • 5.  Competencies

    Posted 11-25-1997 01:08
    Hi all,
    Firstly I should say that I have been working with competencies and
    competences (note, there is a difference) for over ten years now, both
    at organisation and individual levels. Lately I've been working at the
    individual level as it affects the organisational or corporate level -
    primarily because I've found that this is the tool all managers have
    been looking for for so long, a singular description of what people must
    know and do to enable the organisation to achieve its goals and
    objectives.

    In the past too many of us have relied on job descriptions and duty
    statements to describe the skills and knowledge someone must have in any
    particular position. In the past (wayyyyy back in the past) the typical
    business was only a small company run by one boss who knew exactly who
    and what he (and they were 'he' in those days) wanted to achieve his
    goals. And if an individual couldn't provide the right competencies then
    that person was out of a job. Today we are controlled by multi-nationals
    and corporate committees whose primary goal is return on investor dollar
    - and few, if any, at this level would have a clue what competencies are
    required to do this (save for kick the tail of the next level down until
    the bottom line figures change. If that doesn't work - sell the
    division.).

    Competencies (or competency/skill standards as they are known throughout
    the world) identify clearly the skills and knowledge needed to achieve
    these goals and objectives - including (in some countries) the
    competencies required at board or Director level. However, these are
    only useful if they are based on the needs of the functions found within
    the organisation which achieve the desired goals and objectives - not
    the people found in these functions.

    Those organisations using these processes well are starting off with a
    blank sheet and defining what functions are required to achieve whatever
    goals and objectives they've set for the corporation. Once these
    functions have been defined they then identify the skills and knowledge
    needed to fill these functions and these are developed as competency /
    skills standards. THEN it is determined whether or not there are people
    currently filling those functions and, if so, whether or not their
    skills and knowledge match those determined as essential for the
    achievement of the goals and objectives (ie, the competency/skills
    standards). If the answer is yes then they provide, through the
    appraisal system, goals and challenges for these people to strive
    towards in the achievement of corporate objectives. If the answer is no
    then the appropriate training and development strategies are put into
    place. In most cases the answer is usually yes to some competencies and
    no to others.

    Now, these competencies are determined in 'output' terms, not (training)
    input terms which means that people are assessed against an outcome of
    the application of certain skills and knowledge as determined in the
    competency/skills standards, not in whether or not they've 'learned' the
    skills and knowledge. Traditionally we trainers would have said that
    these competencies are training objectives and thereby assess people
    against their progress towards the learning outcome. Not any more.
    Employers want 'competent' people, not 'trained' people (there is a big
    difference) and it is for this reason that many employers will go for
    someone with a good track record before going for someone with more
    degrees than a compass. Well, the smart employers will anyway. Why else
    do we have so many university educated taxi drivers and street sweepers?
    Why are there so many people with university educations working for
    people with only high school or college diplomas? Check out Bill Gates'
    CV.

    The bottom line is that competency (as determined by what a person must
    do, in the workplace, in a variety of settings, and in a team based
    environment) is at the centre of the Human Side of business (ie, the
    part of the triumverate most often missed in business courses where
    concentration is most often on Technical and Conceptual skills). For
    those who care this is better explained in the attached PowerPoint
    slide. (See the very bottom - I think. My competencies at computer
    literacy could be called into question......!)

    Now, to answer the specifics raised by Lynn in her posting:

    Lynn Vavra wrote:
    >
    > Thank you Aim� Heene, for bringing up the subject of competencies, though it may have been discussed here earlier & I may have missed it. If so, I apologize.
    >
    > I am currently writing an article RE: career development center within public sector organizations, and one of the points addressed is the trend towards "building competencies". While Aim�'s question is a search for publications addressing competence in organizational dimensions, I am interested in the current popularity of competencies addressed by HRM on the individual level, especially in lieu of Aim�'s reference:
    >
    > "The 'competence' concept as it has been developed in strategic management literature is however an ORGANIZATIONAL concept, which has of course to do with competence of individuals, but which is not exactly referring to these individual competencies. (Sanchez, et al, Dynamics of Competence Based Competition, 1996)."
    >
    Competence as it is described here is far different to competency and it
    is in this that people are so often sent off on the wrong track.
    Competence describes something that someone (or, in the above reference,
    an organisation) can do. Competency, on the other hand, is a compilation
    of what people can do, how well they manage all of the little jobs that
    go into what it is they are doing, whether or not they can fix things
    when these little jobs go wrong, and being able to contextualise
    whatever they are doing in order to meet the needs of where they are
    doing it at the time - including working together in teams. Note, as I
    said above, competency is written for the function the person fills, not
    the person him/herself.

    Imagine the question: "Can your organisation do such and such?" Some
    would say that this is questionning the competency of the organisation.
    But organisations can do nothing without the people inside of them. It
    is these people who have the competency as shown in their application of
    skills and knowledge which determine whether or not there is
    organisational competence.

    My father once said that he never saw a ship win a battle - it was the
    sailors on board that won the battle. Without them the ship was nothing
    but a funny shaped island floating around getting in the way of things.


    > My question to the list, then, is: so what about those competencies? Are they indeed being packaged for HRM at the individual level? And if that's the case, is it appropriate?

    They are being packaged for HRM only by those people who haven't yet
    cottoned on to the fact that not all HR related matters have a training
    start or finish point. The best practitioners in the world are, in fact,
    packaging competencies as an OD strategy. Check out Champy and Hammer,
    and in fact anything else on Reengineering, and you will see the 'why'
    of competencies. Check out Rutherford (and, just to show I'm not too
    egotistic, anyone else writing on the subject) and you'll see the 'how'.


    >A well-known consultant in the career development field, Betsey Collard of Career Action Center up in Silicon Valley, has come out against the use of competencies for use at the individual level. Her perspective is that with the psychological contract broken, employees as well as employers should support employee career self-reliance. Competencies drag both parties back into the outdated paternalistic relationship.
    >

    If Betsey is saying that competencies unaligned to corporate needs are a
    waste of time and effort then I am on her team. Putting competencies at
    the HRM level is to say that people are 1000% responsible for
    identifying what they must be doing to achieve the corporate goals and
    objectives (oh, and by the way, we're not going to tell you what these
    goals and objectives are), and how their actions are to be assessed
    (which, by the way, we're going to be doing - against criteria that
    we're not going to disclose to you).

    Remember the old saying? People are hired for their skills and fired for
    their behaviour. Skills are a personal thing which people bring to a job
    (and are then upskilled - to meet ever changing organisational needs
    when they get there - and defined in terms of competency), but behaviour
    is something that changes with contexts and conditions - and usually
    measured by others. Our argument is that if the behaviour is so
    important that people will be fired for it, why weren't they recruited
    for it in the first place? The reason? No-one in the organisation knows
    how to accurately capture what this behaviour should be. But we do - by
    writing it into the competency/skills standard.


    > I would very much like to hear from any HRM professionals who have
    implemented or are considering competencies for their organization.
    Please feel free to respond to this list if others are interested, or
    directly to me & I will summarize for the list. Thank you.
    >
    > Lynn Vavra


    Lynn, I know this is a bit long-winded but you offered me an opportunity
    to leap up on my favourite soap box and I took it. Thank you and I hope
    this helped.

    Please feel free to give me a call if you want to talk this through any
    further.

    Regards

    PHIL RUTHERFORD
    robnphil@ozemail.com.au


  • 6.  Competencies

    Posted 11-25-1997 01:22
    Just wanted to let you know that when I worked in hospital management, JCAHO
    (Joint Commission for Accreditation of Healthcare Organizations) required us
    to develop competencies for all positions and then base training and
    development plans on those competencies. The info had to be documented for
    all employees in their personnel files. This was a new requirement back in
    1994, I believe it was, so I wrote lots of Competency Skill Assessments for
    many positions! This process was not part of the performance appraisal or
    reward system process.

    At 11:28 PM 11/24/97 -0500, you wrote:
    >Thank you Aimé Heene, for bringing up the subject of competencies, though
    >it may have been discussed here earlier & I may have missed it. If so, I
    >apologize.
    >
    >I am currently writing an article RE: career development center within public
    >sector organizations, and one of the points addressed is the trend towards
    >"building competencies". While Aimé's question is a search for publications
    >addressing competence in organizational dimensions, I am interested in the
    >current popularity of competencies addressed by HRM on the individual level,
    >especially in lieu of Aimé's reference:
    >
    > "The 'competence' concept as it has been developed in strategic management
    >literature is however an
    > ORGANIZATIONAL concept, which has of course to do with competence of
    >individuals, but which is
    > not exactly referring to these individual competencies. (Sanchez, et al,
    >Dynamics of Competence
    > Based Competition, 1996)."
    >
    >My question to the list, then, is: so what about those competencies? Are
    >they indeed being packaged for HRM at the individual level? And if that's
    >the case, is it appropriate? A well-known consultant in the career
    >development field, Betsey Collard of Career Action Center up in Silicon
    >Valley, has come out against the use of competencies for use at the
    >individual level. Her perspective is that with the psychological contract
    >broken, employees as well as employers should support employee career
    >self-reliance. Competencies drag both parties back into the outdated
    >paternalistic relationship.
    >
    >I would very much like to hear from any HRM professionals who have
    >implemented or are considering competencies for their organization. Please
    >feel free to respond to this list if others are interested, or directly to me
    >& I will summarize for the list. Thank you.
    >
    >Lynn Vavra
    >
    >


  • 7.  Competencies

    Posted 11-25-1997 08:03
    At the University of Michigan we are developing a teaching model for
    leadership (team building) based on competencies. We have identified
    about 40 areas such as active listening, assertive behavior, goal
    setting, etc that are important. Some of these will be taught as part
    of specific required courses, others will be included in optional
    courses, some will require independent study by students.
    Since most of the competencies require practice for development,
    co-curricular activies become a critical part of the model. We have
    about 700 student organization and are working with Student Affairs
    staff to utilize that resourse as part of the total plan.
    Our expectation is that students will make a choice about the level
    of leadership (or interpersonal) skill development that is appropriate
    for their own plans. We will help them assess their current skills and
    develop a learning plan. We will do a detailed assessment of their
    skills at the end of each round, possibly providing some credentialing
    In the College of Engineering we are committed to developing the
    ability to work effectively in multi-disiplinary teams. Towards this
    end we are requiring materials to be included in courses across each
    students four years of education.
    We would love to share our progress and idea. Even more, we would
    like to learn of other groups experiences in this type of education.
    --
    Andrew Crawford, 2785 IOE Bldg, U of Michigan 313 764-9410
    Ascott Corp. 1202 N. Main St., Ann Arbor, MI http://ascott.com


  • 8.  Competencies

    Posted 11-25-1997 23:52
    Andy Crawford wrote:
    >
    > At the University of Michigan we are developing a teaching model for
    > leadership (team building) based on competencies. We have identified
    > about 40 areas such as active listening, assertive behavior, goal
    > setting, etc that are important. Some of these will be taught as part
    > of specific required courses, others will be included in optional
    > courses, some will require independent study by students.
    --
    > Andrew Crawford, 2785 IOE Bldg, U of Michigan 313 764-9410
    > Ascott Corp. 1202 N. Main St., Ann Arbor, MI http://ascott.com

    Greetings Andrew:

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  • 9.  Competencies

    Posted 11-26-1997 08:21
    Andy Crawford wrote:
    >
    > At the University of Michigan we are developing a teaching model for
    > leadership (team building) based on competencies. We have identified
    > about 40 areas such as active listening, assertive behavior, goal
    > setting, etc that are important. Some of these will be taught as part
    > of specific required courses, others will be included in optional
    > courses, some will require independent study by students.
    > Since most of the competencies require practice for development,
    > co-curricular activies become a critical part of the model. We have
    > about 700 student organization and are working with Student Affairs
    > staff to utilize that resourse as part of the total plan.
    > Our expectation is that students will make a choice about the level
    > of leadership (or interpersonal) skill development that is appropriate
    > for their own plans. We will help them assess their current skills and
    > develop a learning plan. We will do a detailed assessment of their
    > skills at the end of each round, possibly providing some credentialing
    > In the College of Engineering we are committed to developing the
    > ability to work effectively in multi-disiplinary teams. Towards this
    > end we are requiring materials to be included in courses across each
    > students four years of education.
    > We would love to share our progress and idea. Even more, we would
    > like to learn of other groups experiences in this type of education.
    > --
    > Andrew Crawford, 2785 IOE Bldg, U of Michigan 313 764-9410
    > Ascott Corp. 1202 N. Main St., Ann Arbor, MI http://ascott.com



    Andrew Crawford,

    Please review the competencies described at:

    http://www.learning-resources.com/sms2.htm

    These are competencies measured by a video-delivered assessment
    instrument widely used by employers, both as part of a managerial
    selection process and to identify developmental needs of incumbents.

    Additonal information appears at:

    http://www.learning-resources.com

    Please let me know if I can be of any help in the future.

    Alan Lesure
    Learning Resources, Inc.
    Phone: 203-637-5047